This
is one of the most interesting NDEs you will
ever read. After evaluating
Guenter Wagner's
childhood NDE profiled here, I have found some
very interesting aspects about it. His discussion
of the "black world" is a very good description
of the
void
experience which many experiencers have described.
In the void, or what
the Bible refers to as "outer
darkness,"
there exists all kinds of mischievous souls.
These souls often refuse to enter the light
for some reason. They are souls with heavy negative
vibrations and are often thought to be "demons".
But souls of higher vibrations (i.e. light beings)
try to bring these unfortunate souls into the
light which they ultimately succeed in doing.
Many
near-death accounts involve this void and it
is generally only a transitory space that people
travel through (usually by means of the tunnel)
to get to the light. Some people spend more
time in the void than others, but the evidence
suggests that souls remain there until they
find within themselves the love that causes
them to be attracted to the light and leave
the void.
Guenter's
NDE is like many others in that he experiences
the Being of Light (whom he identifies as Jesus),
the void, and a very interesting life review.
He also experiences time travel, but Guenter's
time travel experience is like none I have ever
read. Although his NDE may seem unusual at times
(because the void experience can be unusual),
this is a good example of the subjective nature
of NDEs. It is also a long near-death account
but certainly well worth reading.
1. His Accident and Out-of-Body Experience |
I
do not know exactly how old I was when I had
this experience, but everything happened in
our new home, so I must have been 11 years old,
at least.
On that day I left
my flat on the first floor when, all of a sudden,
I heard a voice behind me. I quickly turned
around but there was nobody. I cannot recall
the exact words, but the voice said, in effect,
that the quality of my world that I knew of
was nothing compared to the one that he would
be able to show me. “Nonsense,” I said to myself
and started to run down the stairs to the basement
in a boisterous and cheerful way. There were
only a few steps left when I jumped up high
knocking my head against the ceiling.
The impact of this
blow sent me down on my knees and I quickly
passed out. I fell into a deep blackness. I
remember going through a kind of black hose.
At the end of it, I felt being drawn back by
a mysterious force, but I resisted because I
did not want to go back through that black hose
again. I went forward and suddenly I found myself
in a gray space.
I did not know where
I was, and, looking around, I saw in some distance
someone slowly coming towards me. Actually,
I did not see this figure at all because there
was nothing to look at. However, I sensed a
gray figure being there. I definitely knew that
there was someone. I said, "I have lost my way.
Could you please show me the right way back?"
The next thing I
knew was that I was lying on the basement floor.
I heard this extremely uncomfortable ringing
noise, which gradually became more and more
intense. Then the noise stopped, and, all of
a sudden, I realized that a white, gauze-like
material was very slowly oozing out of my head.
It took on the shape
of a very long stocking and floated at a slight
angle right above me. I became very embarrassed,
because I did not want to be seen by anyone
with this material coming out of me. Meanwhile,
more of this gauze-like material was collecting
itself under the ceiling and I could not do
anything to stop it. I did not feel any pain
whatsoever in this process.
Suddenly it dawned
on me that I was out of my body. It must have
happened the moment this oozing stopped. I saw
a body lying on the floor, which could only
belong to me. I was shivering and I quickly
wanted to return to my body and its warmth when
I heard someone say:
"Stop! Before
going back, see what it is like outside!"
|
[Webmaster
note: I believe this is the voice of
another soul in the
Void]
However, I did not
pay any attention to the voice. Although I could
not see any physical body but my own, this voice
was quite near. Then I heard it again, this
time it was begging me very earnestly:
"Please,
do not go back, I beseech you.
Why do you not want to discover
your new faculties first? You
may still go back if you do
not like them.”
|
|
I hesitated.
After all, this voice was right. Why
shouldn't I give it a try? On that the
voice said quickly:
|
"Test
your mind! If you do you will
discover that you can think
in a way you have never experienced
before."
|
|
The voice was
right again. I could think very lucidly
indeed, and I was able to understand
very quickly with a directness that
did not leave a trace of doubt. Then
I heard the voice again:
|
"If
you are willing to stay outside
of your body, you will make
a wonderful journey and you
will see many interesting things.
However, you must decide quickly!
So hurry up!"
|
|
Eventually I
began to consider the whole situation.
It was really up to me whether I wanted
to return to my body and live the life
on Earth with all its limitations and
with all its joy or to stay outside
in this condition of clear thinking.
The voice again urged me to hurry up
and to tell him whether I had made up
my mind.
|
I
gave in. I decided to stay outside and I instantly
realized that my body had to die, meaning total
destruction by decay. I thought to myself, "How
sad for my mother!"
As for me, I did
not feel any regrets, because my body was now
only a wrapper to me, a burden of which I freed
myself the moment I had decided to stay outside.
Presently I realized
that I was able to move freely about in a way
I had never experienced before. I was floating
right through the walls of our house (I saw
my mother in front of the kitchen stove cooking
a meal) and up into the sky. In the distance,
I saw a great shining ball, which was the sun.
I felt irresistibly attracted to it by its brightness
and I wanted to go right into it. No sooner
had I thought this when I hit something that
catapulted me far out into blackness. I tried
once more, but it all happened again. I quickly
learned that there had to be an invisible barrier
that I could only approach but not overcome.
I had another go
and this time I stopped right in front of this
barrier in order to watch the sun, which was
now shining in a reddish glow. Its size was
relatively small because I had to look at it
from a distance, which was determined by this
invisible barrier. Nevertheless, the reddish
glow of the sun did not satisfy me at all.
Suddenly the voice
said, "There are
more lights!"
|
As I was looking
around, I saw in the distance a multitude of
other lights, which shone much brighter than
the Earth's sun. I wanted to be with those lights!
Although they were far, far away, I could reach
them in an instant. However, each individual
light had its own effective barrier that knocked
me off into the blackness again every time I
tried to approach it.
Getting in contact
with these barriers was very unpleasant, because
every time I touched them, my whole being was
violently shaken.
All
of a sudden, the voice said, "Look for a
single, bright light and approach it
slowly."
|
[Webmaster
note: I believe this is either the
voice of a helpful light being or a helpful
soul in the void.]
I chose an individual
light whose brightness was much greater than
all the other lights around it and I approached
it very carefully. I saw a huge ball burning
incredibly bright. The voice told me that it
was one of the many stars that I was able to
see from the Earth.
I was watching this
ball for quite a long time until I could not
look at it any longer. Therefore, I withdrew
into the blackness again. I began to consider
my situation. I could not stay in that blackness
forever. There must be a way out. I looked around
and I saw another cluster of stars that was
strangely twisted.
I wanted to go there
but I heard the voice say, "They are all
alike. Go up!"
|
I did not know where
up was, but tried all the same - with success,
because I saw very far away, over the blackness,
a shimmering line. I wanted to go there in spite
of that incredibly long distance, but I only
wanted to go to the edge of this line, because
I did not know whether it had a barrier or not.
Return
to Top
|
6. Entering
a Heavenly World Through the Tunnel |
|
 |
I
covered the distance instantly. This time there
was no barrier that would repel me. The light
came from another world. (While our world is
black with lights in it - this other world is
bright). However, I could not enter this world.
I was moving around in every direction trying
to figure out a passageway to this world. I
soon realized that there was only one possibility:
Hurling myself down this black abyss that lay
right in front of me. I hesitated. I did not
have the courage to jump.
|
|
But, suddenly, I
heard the voice again, "There is
no other way! You will have to jump!
Jump! Jump!"
|
Then I jumped. I
do not know what happened next, but I do remember
very vividly that I suddenly found myself moving
at a tremendous speed through
a tunnel of blackness. I had entered this
tunnel headfirst. My whole being was in a kind
of a cylinder or pipe and I shot through this
tunnel like a capsule in the tubes of a pneumatic
post.
I was moving faster
and faster, until I was ejected far into this
new universe. The blackness was instantly substituted
by a sort of dim brightness (if I may say so).
I tumbled over myself several times very vehemently
until I felt being slowed down by this new world.
I remember thinking, "Why are they treating
me so rough?"
I felt this new world
closing in on while simultaneously the old world
was retreating until I was completely taken
up by this new world.
While
being ejected I heard the voice
shout at me, "This
is your world! You do not belong to
us! You have to remain in this world!
Don't you ever try to come back."
|
I turned around and
I saw a piece of the black world, which I must
have trailed behind me while being ejected,
withdraw to the opening where it was finally
sucked up. The moment the old world was shut
out, I was immediately taken up by the new one,
so much so, that I was thoroughly convinced
that I could only further exist in this new
world. I had no choice anyway. The black world
was gone. I was now an inseparable part of this
new world. I thought to myself, "This scoundrel
of a voice! He has betrayed me by forcing me
into this world. There is no way back! This
is final! Hopefully, I will be able to breathe
and not suffocate to death."
Therefore, I tried
to breathe, but I soon found out that no breathing
was necessary. I simply could exist. As long
as I was in the black world, I had never thought
about breathing.
As I said earlier,
everything around me was dimly bright. Although
it was bright, I could not see clearly. The
impact of the finality of the condition I was
in was overwhelming. Although I felt being part
of this new world I did not know anything about
it. I felt utterly alone, betrayed, very tiny
and insignificant. No other soul far and wide.
I started wailing about my situation. I did
not know what to do. I felt very miserable.
All right, I was
able to move freely wherever I wanted to go.
However, where should I go? No one was there!
No one? Nevertheless, there were voices very
far away! In fact, I heard two voices.
I could
hear them say, in complete
disbelief, something like, "Look,
look, there is a little soul! Look there
is a young soul! What is he doing here?
How did he come here?"
|
Voices in this world
were actually no voices at all. Something was
thought and I immediately understood what they
were talking about. What I am reporting now
are impressions and not the meaning of actual
words. These impressions were, however, so clear
that I had no doubts whatsoever.
I continued complaining
that I would not know anyone in this bright
world and that I had been forced to come there.
The voices drew nearer. However, I could not
see anybody. I simply sensed their presence,
which was very fine with me. I now knew that
there were beings in that world with whom I
was able to communicate. Beings, however, that
were simultaneously strangers, but friendly
ones.
The beings urged
me to go back where I had come from. I thought
this very ridiculous being now a part of this
new world. Moreover, even if I really wanted
to go back, which was impossible, how should
I proceed? In addition, even if I did succeed
in finding my way back, I would not have the
slightest idea where my native world, Earth,
lay. Then I sensed that they wanted to force
me out of this world. I became very upset and
I thought, "No one can force me to leave this
world. I have a right to stay here, because
I am a part of it."
The two beings must
have understood what I was thinking, because
I could not sense their voices any longer. Then,
one of the beings guided me (I do not know how)
to a place that I had not seen before. The other
one must have gone away calling for assistance
in attempting to find the right approach of
how a situation like that should be handled.
This
place turned out to be a meadow with many flowers
in it. It was a wonderful meadow, but I knew
that it was only an image of a meadow, somehow
conjured up and suspended in this new world.
The being asked me to play on the meadow, but
I could not. I simply did not know how.
All of a sudden,
I was aware of a tiny bright light far away
in the "sky" but rapidly coming nearer and nearer.
It was shaped like a ball and it was indescribably
bright. I tried to shade my eyes, but I did
not need to. Despite its incredible brightness
and brilliance, it did not dazzle me a bit!
Presently, this light
stopped at a distance right above me. It was
a sun about the same size as the sun of our
world, but it was indescribably brighter. I
kept staring at this sun wondering how a light
could possess such brilliance. The brightness
of the lights in the black world was brilliant,
too, but of a different nature.
Suddenly I realized
that it was scrutinizing me very closely. On
that, it opened up, and a beam came pouring
down on me.
And
I heard it shouting at me, "I can destroy
you if you do not tell the truth about
your being here!"
|
I answered, "But
I do not know anything else but the truth!"
Then something happened
that I would never, never forget. Love, pure,
utter love came pouring down on me along with
incredible warmth. My whole soul or being was
immersed in this love. He lifted me up and gave
me a kiss on my mouth. This Being of Light loved
me deeply, infinitely deeply, and more and more
intensively. I was happy! I could have stayed
in this beam of love forever. If my story had
been a lie, the Being of Light would have annihilated
me. I had a clear conscience anyway, so there
was no reason to fear anything.
Gradually the loving
became weaker and I felt that something was
wrong with me - something that made it very
difficult for the light to continue with his
love. He was trying not to tell me why.
Finally, however,
he was not able to keep it up any longer and
he quickly said, "You have
a smelly breath. You need a bath."
|
[Webmaster
note: I believe this is a reference
to the purification process many souls need
to undergo after death. The phrase "smelly breath"
is probably a reference to "smelly thoughts"
or negative thoughts which are incompatible
with existence in the higher afterlife realms.
In these realms, communication is telepathic;
so if you enter into the afterlife with "stinking
thinking," such thoughts become aware to everyone
in that realm as a form of "thought bacteria."
Various NDE testimonies describe how negative
thought processes must be purified before entering
these higher realms. See
Arthur Yensen's NDE testimony
for a more detailed understanding.]
I
received the impression that I would have to
take a bath similar to that I was used to on
Earth, but by dipping the whole body. It was
made plain to me that this process was going
to be unpleasant, but I could stop it when it
became too painful for me to bear.
Although I could
not comprehend the reason, I was willing to
do what the Being of Light wanted me to do.
I was lifted up and put into a red light. I
closed my eyes. I could not feel anything. I
did not know for how long I had been in this
state. After some time, however, I realized
that I was being tossed about rather rigorously.
It was like being in a washing machine. I cried,
"I think that is enough!"
Immediately, I was
lowered down and the love and the warmth were
switched off, but I still remained in this beam
(or
sphere).
Suddenly
the sun disappeared and I saw a moon. I was
in a different world. Everything was black but
the moon, which was right in front of me. It
was much clearer and more refulgent than the
moon in our world. There was not a trace of
blackness in it. The moon was surrounded by
a wreath of little, bright stars. I kept staring
at this shiny moon when suddenly I felt a strange
sensation entering through my left eye and spreading
into the deepest recesses of my brain.
I was wondering about
the fact that I could distinctly see the moon
with my left eye that had always been weaker
than my right one and I suddenly realized that
right in front of me were all the answers to
any questions we might have on Earth. I got
very excited about this and I tried to locate
the place about which I wanted to tell our scientists
on Earth that they should come and see this
extraordinary place.
I tried to pinpoint
this place by looking at the left side of the
moon and counting the little bright stars. However,
in doing so I realized that they were not stars
but in turn little moons.
Again, I was looking
at the left side of the moon and the more I
was looking the more little moons were coming
up in a straight line, one little moon after
the other. There was no hope of locating this
place. Then I began to feel cold and I was shivering.
I remembered the sun of our world, its warmth
that sometimes may have been too hot but, overall,
it was life-giving warmth. I desperately wanted
to return to the bright, living sun. Only then
did I realize that I was looking at the moon
with my left eye while my right eye was closed.
I wanted to open my right eye to see the sun
again but I was not able to.
I wanted to leave
the moon, which I was no longer interested in.
I wanted to go back to the bright, living sun.
I tried very hard but in vain, I even felt an
extremely unpleasant pain in my head. All of
a sudden, however, the moon with its black surroundings
disappeared and I saw this incredible bright
sun again.
Suddenly
the sun started to move backwards changing its
colors to a deep dark red. It kept moving back
into the sky until it was a very tiny red light
- like a point. Then it began to move very quickly.
At one time I saw the bright sun on the left
side and then the red sun on the right side,
dancing, as it were, from left to right and
from right to left.
I felt that the sun
wanted to communicate with me. I thought to
myself that up here the suns cannot speak but
just move about and that this was their way
of talking. Then it stood still and I saw the
bright sun in front of the tiny red sun. Nevertheless,
I could not make out what this was all about.
I regarded the whole spectacle more as a funny
and entertaining act than anything else. However,
it was not funny at all. I suddenly felt that
I should be transferred back into the world
with the shiny moon and I remembered the unpleasant
pain and the cold that I had encountered there.
Suddenly I realized
that the bright sun in front of me was the shiny
moon and that the red sun had the moon safely
under control making in fact one sun. This was
the message that the sun had wanted to get across.
Then
the Being of Light wanted to talk to me on a
man-to-man basis. He placed me on top of a high
mountain where I had to sit on a large piece
of rock.
I asked him why he
had wanted to destroy me, and he told me that
there existed also evil but very powerful and
cunning beings who were his enemies with whom
he had been constantly fighting. He also told
me that I had to warn my world against them,
and I automatically nodded in agreement. He
said that his enemies had wanted to play a trick
on him by using me as a kind of trap, but he
had to defend this world and the black one.
His world, however, would be much easier for
him to defend, because the evil beings had no
power in it and he had no power in the black
world.
I realized having
been positioned in such a way that I was able
to overlook a huge stretch of clouds that were
marvelously illuminated from below. Suddenly
a flash of lightning whose intense light was
much greater than that of the bright world,
forced me to look up. Then a big bang followed,
but I was totally unperturbed. On the horizon,
I saw smoke bulging out of the clouds and gradually
taking on the shape of a mushroom. It grew larger
and larger and brighter and brighter. I was
in complete awe. Suddenly everything was gone.
I heard the
light call, "Look
here!"
|
|
I turned around,
and I heard screams and I saw fire and
smoke almost surrounding me.
|
|
I did not comprehend
what this was all about, when suddenly
the light cried:
|
"I
will do everything in my power
to prevent this from happening!"
|
|
Then everything
was over. Again, the bright light wanted
to talk about his enemies. However,
I was still very impressed with what
had just happened. So I thought to myself,
"Oh no, not again!"
|
|
However, the light
made me aware of the fact that this war had
been going on for a very long time, and the
evil beings had become more and more powerful,
and if this continued he would not see any means
of preventing them from taking over everything.
He said that if the enemy had really succeeded
in coming into his world, the war would have
been lost. He would have been powerful enough,
no doubt, to fight them off, but the war would
have been lost in the long run. He was really
afraid of loosing this war. Then it was intimated
to me that he needed help. I wanted to help
him, and I replied, "Yes, but how?"
He answered that
the only way I could help him was by going back
and telling my world what had happened to me.
I was completely shocked to hear him say so,
because I did not want to go back. I was so
depressed that I almost started to cry.
All of a sudden
he asked, "Would
you like to know what will become
of you later on in your life?"
|
|
I looked
up and answered cheerfully, "Yes, I
would love to."
|
The light
said, "You
will become a teacher."
|
|
To a certain
extent I was disappointed and repeated,
"A teacher?"
|
The light
replied, "Imagine
a teacher in your world and
show me what it is like being
one."
|
|
I imagined,
quite vividly, a teacher who was standing
in front of his pupils giving lessons.
|
The light
said, "No,
not that kind of teacher."
|
|
I was then
thinking of a university professor lecturing
to his students.
|
The light
said, "Not
that kind of teacher. You are
going to teach the university
teachers!"
|
|
I was surprised
and almost could not believe it. Besides,
I considered this quite difficult. I
imagined a map of my world, and I saw
myself in future life going from place
to place, from university to university
teaching the university teachers of
my world.
|
But the light
said, "No,
not like that. They will come
to you!"
|
|
I replied,
"To my house?"
|
The light
said, "Yes,
imagine such a situation."
|
|
I imagined our
house on Earth, our living room, and
I saw myself sitting on a chair opposite
a stern-looking, respectable professor,
trying to teach him. However, I failed.
I was too embarrassed and too shy. I
said, "I do not think I am clever enough
to do this. Moreover, I have a speech
impediment."
|
The light
replied, "You
will become a new type of teacher
and I am going to explain it
to you in a moment."
|
|
He then paused,
and I looked up and saw myself lying
on a hospital bed that was being pushed
down a very long corridor by a member
of the medical staff. I asked, slightly
alarmed, "Am I being ill?"
|
The light
replied, "No!
Just a little bit confused.
You will be taken to hospital
where you will get a shot and
fall into a very deep sleep."
|
|
I was not
worried any more.
|
And the light
said, "But
let me explain this new type
of teacher. You are going to
teach while being in a sort
of sleep. However, it will not
be the kind of sleep that you
know of. While being asleep,
you will be able to hear and
talk, and they will come to
you and ask you questions."
|
|
I was deeply
impressed, but also worried. So I asked,
"Will I feel pain in this process?"
|
The light
replied, "No,
it will not hurt you."
|
|
I gradually
became accustomed to the idea of becoming
a teacher. So I asked, "Will they also
learn their lessons?"
|
|
He made a suggestive
face, meaning that he was not sure about
that. I asked him another question,
"Will I also teach them when I am awake?"
|
The light
replied, "No,
you will certainly speak to
them when you are awake. But
what you say while being asleep
will be of much more importance."
|
|
And he showed
me a room in which I saw myself sitting
on a chair talking to someone. I actually
did not see myself neither did I see
the person to whom I was speaking. Nevertheless,
I definitely knew that it was I, because
I was now in that room looking about.
I saw a low table, books on the walls,
two windows, and drapes that were moving
in front of a window by a slight draught
of wind.
|
Suddenly
the room disappeared and the light said, "Before
doing this, you will have to
write down everything that has
happened to you. Every detail
of it. You will have to make
a scientific report."
|
|
I said, "Of
course."
|
The light
said, "But
I am afraid you will have forgotten
everything."
|
|
I shook my
head in disbelief.
|
But
he said, "You
cannot even tell me now how
you came here."
|
|
I could not
belief him and tried to remember what
had happened on Earth. However, to my
great surprise, I was not able to do
so.
|
The light said, "Do
not worry. A book will help
you. In fact, there will be
two books, but the first one
will be more important. Besides,
you will have many books."
|
|
Suddenly the light
became quite enthusiastic and said that I was
to be the first teacher of this new type, and
there would be a lot more to come. I was disappointed
to hear him say so. Nevertheless, the light
wanted to show what it meant being the first.
He asked, "What
do you think? How many people
are there in your world?”
|
|
I said, "40
millions may be?"
|
The light
replied, "No,
many more. You must not only
think of those who are alive.
Take into account all the human
beings that are dead and you
will have a huge number of people.
Let us go back in time, as far
back as possible, and tell me
how far back we should go."
|
|
I said, "Middle
Ages?"
|
The light
replied, "No,
farther back."
|
|
I said,
"The birth of Christ?"
|
The light
said, "No,
farther back."
|
|
I was thinking
hard, "Adam and Eve?"
|
The light
replied, "No,
not that. Go farther back in
time and think of what you have
learned in your history lessons."
|
|
I was thinking
for some time. Eventually I blurted
out, "Stone Age?"
|
He was disappointed,
and he said, "You
should have known better, but
I think Stone Age will do."
|
|
He then told
me that in that age there were not many
people living on Earth. However, they
were free to walk wherever they wanted
to go, and that there were no borders
that would keep them from roaming about.
I said, "How beautiful."
|
I
was imagining a map of Europe, which I had seen
in my Atlas, with all its borders. I did not
have much time to think about all this, because,
all of a sudden, I saw human beings back on
Earth. I was looking down on a group of people,
men and women, who were dressed in furs, sitting
around a campfire. I could see a woman with
her baby on her back, and a man who was standing
in front of the group obviously making a speech.
Another man stood a little apart.
All of a sudden,
I heard a loud cry of disappointment, and the
guttural voice of the man in front of the group
of people. I did not understand what he was
saying.
The scene
disappeared and the light said, "I am
going to translate for you,
but you must concentrate very
hard."
|
|
I certainly
wanted to do so, because I was eager
to hear what this man was talking about.
Therefore, I started to concentrate.
|
The light
said, "You
call this concentration? You
have to concentrate much harder!"
|
|
I was amazed
to hear him say so, because I
considered my first attempt quite
satisfactory. Nevertheless, he
wanted me to do better.
|
The
light said, "Let's
have another go!"
|
|
I closed my
eyes and began concentrating
extremely hard. However, the light
was not in the least satisfied.
|
He
said, "I think
it is useless."
|
|
However, suddenly
the tone of his voice became very gentle
and he came close to me and said tenderly:
|
"The
reason for my asking you to
concentrate so hard is that,
later on, you should be able
to tell everything as accurately
as possible. So you need to
concentrate like you have never
done before on what this man
is going to say."
|
|
And he added
in a different voice that betrayed his
disappointment:
|
"This
is a final attempt. If you fail
this time, it will be no use
trying any longer!"
|
|
I was determined
to do my best. I closed my eyes again and tried
as hard as I could to listen to what I was supposed
to hear. All of a sudden, I was able to understand
what the man was saying:
Guenter
Wagner's Brief Experience as
a Cave Man |
|
He said:
|
"Now we have proof.
You have just heard
for yourselves. What
we have been suspecting
is true. He who took
on the difficult task
of making such a dangerous
journey has just returned
and confirmed our suspicion.
They want to resist
us. However, we will
not put up with that.
I have told you again
and again. Now the time
has come to fight them.
We must not wait until
they have become stronger.
They are still weak
now. It is true. Nevertheless,
think of the future!
We will have to attack
them now."
|
|
He was
addressing the group of people
in a very impressive manner.
I was completely impressed and
I could understand very well
why he was forced to attack
his enemies.
|
|
But suddenly I heard this
other man who was standing apart
say:
|
"I am primarily a hunter
and fight the animals.
I am not going to fight
weaklings who start
running away the very
moment they catch sight
of us. Every hunter
would hurt his pride
and honor if he did
such a thing. We hunters
fight the animals, which
are by far more dangerous.
Many brave hunters have
hurt themselves in their
fights. Nevertheless,
we are prepared and
willing to take the
risk because we are
hunters. I will never
fight those weaklings."
|
|
As for me, I could not get
along with what he was saying.
After all, one had to fight
one's enemies. I could not understand
that it should be more honorable
to fight animals than people.
However, I could not go on contemplating
such things, because my eyes
were forced to the ground that
gradually began to move. At
first slowly, but then faster
and faster until I was no longer
able to distinguish any details.
|
|
The
movement suddenly came to a
halt. I saw grassland in front
of me and in the distance there
was the edge of a forest with
very high trees. Suddenly, I
was placed in the woods. Although
I could not see anything, I
knew that I was in this forest,
that is, right in the middle
of a village.
|
|
I could hear the voices
of some people and I heard someone
say:
|
"We cannot run away
forever. How many times
did we have to run away?
Many, many times! Such
beasts! They come and
destroy our village!
And every time we run
away. But not this time!
This time we are going
to stay! It cannot go
on like that forever."
|
|
I could
feel fear and anxiety. They
would have liked to run away
as they had done so many times
before. However, this time they
had made up their minds and
intended to stick to their firm
resolve. However, they were
all full of fear.
|
|
Some voices said:
|
"They eat meat! Imagine
that! Meat! In addition,
they build huge fires
in the prairie. They
dance around the fires
and bathe in blood.
However, what remains
the worst: They eat
meat. The very thought
of it! In the end, they
are going to eat our
flesh, too."
|
|
A voice, a woman's voice,
who was sitting in her hut,
kept saying again and again:
|
"I am afraid. I am terribly
afraid. Oh, how scared
I am! I am scared, so
scared."
|
|
I was able to feel distinctly
her anxiety. Her fear grew stronger
and stronger.
|
|
She
kept saying:
|
"I am scared, I am scared."
|
|
Her
fear began to take hold of me.
At first I thought, “Why is
she so afraid? She must be hysterical.
How on Earth can you be so afraid?!"
|
|
Nevertheless,
I was being immersed, deeper
and deeper, into her feelings
of sheer fear. I could not stand
it any longer! I thought to
myself, "I wish she stopped
worrying now."
|
|
It
was extremely unpleasant indeed.
|
|
Suddenly
everything was over, and the light said
to me: |
"If
they had done nothing, nothing
would have happened. It is true;
they would have come all the
same. However, nothing would
have happened. This, however,
will again lead to further dead
persons!"
|
|
He was
stressing the words - dead persons -
and - again. I felt great
apprehension on the part of the
light concerning the large number of
dead people, so I asked, "Again?"
because I was of the opinion that I
had watched the first human beings
on Earth.
|
The light answered, however, "Hundreds
of thousands."
|
|
I was amazed
at this and I could feel how the
light was suffering from the great
number of dead people. I am not
quite sure about what happened next,
but all of a sudden, I heard a
thunderous, angry voice accusing
mankind, including myself, of
destroying his garden on Earth.
|
The
Being of Light's Message to
Humanity
He
shouted, "I made
you human beings a wonderful
garden and you destroy everything.
Human beings poison the water
and the air. They destroy everything.
At first, the effect of their
work of destruction was limited.
However, it got worse and worse.
They destroy everything that
they can lay their hands on.
Although Man is constantly looking
for other places, he has only
this one place (Earth). You
could see for yourself. And
if they continue to destroy
everything they will blow up
the whole Earth in the end!"
|
|
I was completely
perplexed. After some time, the light
said:
|
"Ask
me that, 'You do not know how
to inform your world.'"
|
|
I answered,
"But you have just told me how to do
it!"
|
However,
he insisted by saying, "Now
you are again a little and ignorant
child that does not know how
to do it!"
|
|
So I asked
him that, being a little and ignorant
child, I would not know how to inform
my world.
|
To my great
surprise, the light answered in an angry
and brusque voice, "You
will know how to do it when
the time is right."
|
|
However, I
did not want to leave him forever.
So I asked him if I could come back
after having told my world and stay
with him permanently.
|
He
said, "No,
you have to go back and live."
|
|
Although I still
did not know my way back, this time
I had no doubts whatsoever. If the Being
of Light wanted me to go back and live,
I simply had to. It did not matter any
longer how it could be done. This light
had absolute power. Nevertheless, I
could still not understand why. I repeatedly
pleaded, "Why? Why can I not come back?
Why? Why? Why? Why am I not allowed
staying on in your very love and warmth?"
|
|
The light answered
that no one could stay permanently with
him. However, I still was not satisfied.
If it was not possible to stay with
him, I surely could come back and stay
in this bright world in which those
two beings were already living!
|
But the light
repeated, "No,
you have to go back and live!"
|
|
I replied,
"But why have these two beings been
allowed to stay?"
|
|
The light answered
that even these two beings could not
stay on permanently. They were only
in this world in order to learn. In
addition, he began to emphasize the
importance of love and learning. He
wanted me to be his apprentice. He the
master, I the apprentice. However, I
still could not see what love and learning
should have to do with my wish to stay
on in this bright world.
|
|
I had,
it was true, to admit that I did not
love the light, but I certainly was
willing to learn everything that he
wanted me to learn. On that, the light
started, to my great dismay, to position
himself further back in the sky, and
I could not feel his presence any longer,
because the beam had been switched off.
I suddenly felt cold and very miserable.
|
However,
one of the other beings asked me to watch a
certain place very carefully. Indeed, they urgently
asked me not to move but to fix my eyes on to
that place. I did what I had been told to and
presently I saw this panoramic review. Very
vividly and distinctly. I was stupefied! The
images of this film moved very rapidly, showing
me my past life on Earth. I could instantly
understand everything that was being shown to
me.
I cannot remember
any of the details, because this was only an
experiment to test my ability whether I was
able to really understand what I was watching.
The beings asked
me several times if I could clearly comprehend
what was being shown. I answered impatiently,
"Of course, of course!"
I was slightly annoyed
about their questions.
In communicating
with the beings, I always used my mouth as I
had done on Earth. This was not the case when
I was talking with the Being of Light.
Thereupon the Being
of Light started to show me my past life again,
but this time the stress lay on the quality
of my soul during my existence on Earth. When
I was watching my past life the first time,
I was just very happy to be able to watch my
former world and myself. I regarded this actually
more as an entertainment than anything else.
I did not feel miserable any longer.
However, the second
time, former events of my life on Earth were
shown with the emphasis on my reaction to certain
situations in terms of love or nastiness or
even hatred. This was made quite clear to me,
and I knew what to look during the second review.
Everything started from the beginning. I could
not see how I came into existence on Earth,
because I only had to mind my behavior with
regard to love or hatred.
At first I was very
satisfied that nothing was happening to which
I could have reacted with either love or hatred.
Then, the film speeded up, but there still was
not anything for which I could have been made
responsible. I was stupid enough to say triumphantly:
"See, there is nothing!"
On that, I could
see a scene in which my twin sister and I were
quarrelling (I could not make out the reason
for the argument), but I instantly knew how
ugly I had behaved. I said to the light, "But
you must understand! This is bad, all right,
but this is the way human beings behave on Earth!
You cannot really blame me for that!"
The great light did
not blame me for anything that I had done on
Earth. Then I was shown some more nasty scenes
on Earth in which I had behaved badly. However,
I still had excuses. Then, I think the great
light became slightly impatient at my stupidity,
no doubt. Suddenly, the film was accelerated
to such an extent that I was unable to distinguish
any images at all. Then it stopped abruptly,
and I was confronted with a situation in which
I behaved extremely badly.
My behavior was tremendously
enhanced, so that every bad aspect of my character
stood out clearly in front of me. It was horrifying!
I could hardly believe this character of mine!
I was finally convinced! Such a soul could never
stay on in this bright world! I had no right,
no claim whatsoever! I was completely shaken
and dejected. I wanted to go back. Yes, there
was really no other way possible.
Then
I saw the light disappear into the "Sky", and
I heard a laughter and the words:
"And he really
thought he could stay on!"
|
Then
the Being of Light was gone. One of the other
beings brought me back to Earth. I do not know
how. I only heard, while being tucked back into
my body, a snapping sound like the sound that
can be heard when you put the lid on top of
a mess tin securing it with the catch. When
I opened my eyes, I remember starting to cry,
"I do not want to die, I do not want to die,
and I do not want to die!"
Then I picked myself
up and in approaching the staircase, I wondered
if there would ever be a way back, whereupon
I heard a voice shout at me:
And
another voice said:
"You must kill
your mother!"
|
[Webmaster
note: These voices are obviously from
a mischievous soul in the void.]
Then I climbed up
the stairs down which I had been jumping so
happily. I could only feel a minor swelling
on the top of my head, which was not particularly
painful.
[Guenter Wagner's
NDE account ends here.]
I am German, male,
unmarried, born 1942. Immediately after my experience,
I was very troubled and I couldn't understand
what had happened to me. I simply did not know
what to do next. I couldn't talk to anybody
about it. I wanted to obey the Being of Light
by writing a scientific report, but I was unable
to do so. I simply did not know how to proceed.
Then suddenly a voice told me that I had to
learn another language. Period.
At night, I felt
very miserable. This went on for about 2 weeks,
when, one night, the Being of Light returned
and said that I had to forget everything. Later
in my life, however, I would encounter great
misery.
Relieved, I turned
myself on the other side and fell asleep. When
I woke up the following morning, I couldn't
recall a single word!! For the following 25
years, I had lived my life the way I wanted
it to live. I became an alcoholic and resigned
from church. I believed neither in God nor in
the other world. However, I did develop a drive
for learning English.
The
big change, though, came in 1980, shortly before
Christmas Eve. On TV, there was a report on
NDEs, and they were talking about a light. Suddenly
it struck me that I, too, had once seen such
a light. Thank God, I could not recall everything
at once. Surely, it would have killed me! I
personally call this my Saul/Paul experience,
because it had a similar effect on me. Saul
had been blind for 3 days and became an apostle
later on and I became a fighter against the
devil in and about me.
The positive effect
of all this was, however, that I instantly got
rid of my alcohol problem. The negative effects
were three suicide attempts in 1981. (The third
one almost being successful). As an after-effect
of alcoholism, I developed a rupture of my stomach
in 1986 whereby I missed the grave only by an
inch. They took out my entire stomach plus other
organs. By the way, no cancer. The Being of
Light was right, after all.
In 1980/81 I couldn't
write down my experience in German, and even
today there is no German translation, because
I have not yet had the inner O.K. from the Being
of Light who is our Lord Jesus Christ. Besides,
it is more difficult for me to translate my
story into German, because the recollection
of the experience was entirely in English, and
I have trouble finding the correct German terms
(I have never been good at translating anyway.)
The following is
an interview by someone who is interested in
near-death experiences.
Question:
You were about 11 years at the time.
Age and worldview have an influence on the NDE
experienced by individuals. Do you think the
Being of Light treated you as a child?
Wagner:
No, I don't. He specifically wanted to talk
to me on a man-to-man basis. At the end of my
report he said and I quote. After some time,
the light said, "Ask me that you do not know
how to inform your world." I answered, "But
you have just told me how to do it!" However,
he insisted by saying, "Now you are again a
little and ignorant child that does not know
how to do it!" So I asked him that, being a
little and ignorant child, I would not know
how to inform my world.
Question:
Such a judgmental light, all the emphasis
on fighting, being told to kill your mother.
How do you feel about this?
Wagner:
Strangely enough, there was not only a voice
at the end of the experience, but right at the
beginning as well. There are not only good guys
in the spiritual world. The Bible calls them
demons, devil, evil beings, serpent, dragon
etc. and on Earth we are constantly surrounded
by them – sometimes people get obsessed by them.
I have been fighting those evil spirits since
1980 and this will continue until I die that
is until I leave my body forever. For instance,
the evil voices told me more than once that
hey were going to kill me. They hate Jesus Christ
and every person who chooses Him. I can testify
to this. Right after my NDE/OBE, however, I
had no idea whatsoever as to whom that voice
was or where it came from.
Question:
How do I feel about this?
Wagner:
Well, in spite of all that has happened, I would
not like to miss one single event of my live.
Since Christmas 1980, I have been able to establish
a personal relationship with the Being of Light
by way of internal fights, visions and auditions
and I am now in a position to go public with
my experience.
Question:
Did you like your mother?
Wagner:
Yes, I did. I did not kill her. She died peacefully
at the age of 92 in 1994.
Question:
There are both hellish and heavenly
aspects to it - both the good and the bad. How
do you explain the loving parts and the not-so-loving
parts, the way you were treated, what you were
told? I am also curious to know about afterward.
Wagner:
Since 1980 I have undergone many temptations
and have thus learned more than during my entire
stay in the other world. You could also say
that through temptations I have drawn the Lord
God Jesus Christ into existence on Earth. Please
don't get me wrong here. The loving parts come
exclusively from our Lord Jesus Christ, who
is God. The term God includes infinity, eternity,
omnipotence, omnipresence, omniscience etc.
However, no one knows what those words actually
mean. That is why the most ancient Jews did
not name God. But this is not so with the name
Jesus Christ. He is God in form, a visible God,
a real person in whom the fullness of the Godhead
dwells (according to Paul). Jesus Christ is
plainly man and all other human beings are made
in His image. (He being the original, we are
the copies, so to speak). His father is Divine
Love itself and He is Divine Wisdom itself and
His will is the Holy Ghost. These three make
one God in Jesus Christ. In 1996, He made me
aware of what it really means when you say you
have prayed to God, namely nothing. A very unpleasant
experience indeed, actually one of the worst
experiences I have ever had in this respect.
(Horrible, terrifying, harrowing). The not-so-loving
parts stem from malicious, evil spirits. I do
not know whether you have ever experienced their
malice and their slanderous behavior. Their
hatred is indescribable. They were once physical
human beings. However, they did and still do
love evil and without love no one can exist.
Our Lord God Jesus Christ has the power to destroy
them, no doubt, but He will not do so, because
of their free will and their love. Love is what
constitutes man (either way).
The Being of Light
(our Lord Jesus Christ) is my master and I am
His apprentice, as He told me so in my NDE/OBE.
Actually, it is not me who fights these evil
beings; it is He who does so. He told me so
in His “lecture” on the importance of love and
learning. I said in my report, and I quote,
"In addition, he began to emphasize the importance
of love and learning." In this sentence alone
is hidden more than words can tell and so it
is with the entire account. In January 1987,
for example, He taught me, "I am nothing. I
can do nothing. I have nothing. I am dead. I
am what I am through the Lord Jesus Christ.
I can do what I can do through the Lord Jesus
Christ. I have what I have through the Lord
Jesus Christ. I am alive."
In April last year
He came to me in person (although I did not
see him) and set my whole heart and chest on
fire. However, this is another story. And so
on and so on.
Question:
What was it like for you after the accident?
Wagner:
Please refer to the above.
Question:
You were only 11 years old. Was your body different
in any way? Were your abilities and perceptions
different in any way? How did you feel inside?
How was school for you afterwards? Did you feel
any different in your family?
Wagner:
I had forgotten my NDE and I led a normal life.
No special feelings, occurrences etc. whatsoever.
Question:
With your twin sister?
Wagner:
She knows nothing about it. No one in my family
knows about my experience; let alone my colleagues.
Question:
You must have been caught up in the war years
and what happened to Germany and with the Nazis.
Wagner:
No, I have not. I was born in 1942, the war
ended in 1945. I had a happy childhood. We didn't
have much to eat, though, but we never starved.
My hometown was not subject to enemy attacks
and remained intact.
Question:
Did your experience at the age of 11 make any
difference in what you saw, how you felt, about
what was going on around you?
Wagner:
No, it did not. I simply didn't understand what
had happened to me and I kept thinking about
it.
Question:
Do you suppose that your experience presaged
(prepared you for) the war?
Wagner:
No, I do not. I was a baby at that time.
Question:
Do you suppose the Being of Light was so mean
and spoke so much of fighting because that is
what your world was filled with at that time?
Wagner:
No, I do not. Besides, our world is still filled
with fighting. (The Being of Light is never
mean, ever.)
Question:
Did your experience prepare you for the war
and the after-effects of the war, how it would
affect you as a youngster, and what you would
have to go through?
Wagner:
No, it did not. I forgot everything.
Question:
I do believe you had a near-death experience,
not just an out-of-body experience.
Wagner:
So do I.
Question:
I have found that with the majority of child
experiencers of near-death states, it takes
about 20 to 30 years, even 40 years, before
they are able to understand what happened to
them and integrate their experience.
Wagner:
That is most certainly true.
Question:
Many turn to alcohol within about 5 to 8 years
of their experience.
Wagner:
You are right on, indeed. I turned to alcohol
when I was about 20 years old. By the way, I
had three OBEs altogether; the first one during
birth, the second one when I was about four,
the third one at the age of 11 or 12. In 1980/81,
while recollecting my experience, I recalled
those two other experiences, as well, which
made things worse at the time.
Question:
I suspect there is more to your story.
Wagner:
You are certainly right here.
|